I am having a mental breakdown (ALS Fear)

[Cubanborn87 42]

31 minutes ago, anxietyprince said:

Yes muscle wasting that presents more bone:skin ratio - it happens when you’re unable to “excersise” the muscle because of disease or injury - I am young and with little experience - but how could atrophy be taking place if you don’t feel weaker in anyway?  

That's exactly what I showed my doctor a few month ago , I actually have a few pictures in other posts where you can see my hand and my foot. When I stretch my toes up you can see the bones on my left foot a lot more and on my left hand the bone that goes from the thumb to the wrist also sticks out more when I stretch my hands out.

[utrocket09 115]

3 minutes ago, Cubanborn87 said:

That's exactly what I showed my doctor a few month ago , I actually have a few pictures in other posts where you can see my hand and my foot. When I stretch my toes up you can see the bones on my left foot a lot more and on my left hand the bone that goes from the thumb to the wrist also sticks out more when I stretch my hands out.

Just because you can see your bones does not mean atrophy....

I'll ask again...do you know what atrophy actually is....

If your doc saw it and didnt say anything...not atrophy

[anxietyprince 4]

But are they significantly weaker/failing? Again I have little experience being young but I don’t see how atrophy can come about without being significantly weaker as it’s the muscle that’s thinning. Also, are you sure it’s not the ligament you’re looking out when stretching your hands? I can see mine stick out as well & I am not skinny by any mean at all. If it’s the bone ON your wrist then I could see your concern but also my left wrist is smaller than my right. Not sure on your age, health, preferences ect. But if I was scared I would try doing a weekly routine of squats/jogging/walking hills & pushups (knees or regular) & if you start to feel/see the mass coming back or inflating at all then I doubt that’s a sign of atrophy. I used to play college baseball & after a knee injury I loss considerable muscle mass - it happens especially dependent on age/lifestyle as I stopped working out completely. 

[anxietyprince 4]

& when I stretch my toes / fingers I see ligaments popping not bone (might be diff for you) try pushing on it and see if it’s squishy (sounds stupid) but ligaments runs across the top of your feet and hands especially when you stretch so you’d see those before bone 

[utrocket09 115]

8 minutes ago, anxietyprince said:

But are they significantly weaker/failing? Again I have little experience being young but I don’t see how atrophy can come about without being significantly weaker as it’s the muscle that’s thinning. Also, are you sure it’s not the ligament you’re looking out when stretching your hands? I can see mine stick out as well & I am not skinny by any mean at all. If it’s the bone ON your wrist then I could see your concern but also my left wrist is smaller than my right. Not sure on your age, health, preferences ect. But if I was scared I would try doing a weekly routine of squats/jogging/walking hills & pushups (knees or regular) & if you start to feel/see the mass coming back or inflating at all then I doubt that’s a sign of atrophy. I used to play college baseball & after a knee injury I loss considerable muscle mass - it happens especially dependent on age/lifestyle as I stopped working out completely. 

Your muscles don't just atrophy without weakness. 

[anxietyprince 4]

1 minute ago, utrocket09 said:

Your muscles don't just atrophy without weakness. 

My left hand hasn’t been weak for 3 weeks - is that normal with anxiety? Not failing to do anything - just feels easier to drop stuff or shaky 

[utrocket09 115]

46 minutes ago, anxietyprince said:

My left hand hasn’t been weak for 3 weeks - is that normal with anxiety? Not failing to do anything - just feels easier to drop stuff or shaky 

There is feeling weak and actual weakness.

[Cubanborn87 42]

1 hour ago, utrocket09 said:

Just because you can see your bones does not mean atrophy....

I'll ask again...do you know what atrophy actually is....

If your doc saw it and didnt say anything...not atrophy

I see him in 6 weeks , I wonder what he will say then. Because it seems more profound now that it was 2 months ago

[Cubanborn87 42]

1 hour ago, anxietyprince said:

But are they significantly weaker/failing? Again I have little experience being young but I don’t see how atrophy can come about without being significantly weaker as it’s the muscle that’s thinning. Also, are you sure it’s not the ligament you’re looking out when stretching your hands? I can see mine stick out as well & I am not skinny by any mean at all. If it’s the bone ON your wrist then I could see your concern but also my left wrist is smaller than my right. Not sure on your age, health, preferences ect. But if I was scared I would try doing a weekly routine of squats/jogging/walking hills & pushups (knees or regular) & if you start to feel/see the mass coming back or inflating at all then I doubt that’s a sign of atrophy. I used to play college baseball & after a knee injury I loss considerable muscle mass - it happens especially dependent on age/lifestyle as I stopped working out completely. 

Yeah, I might try to do that. No I don't feel weakness. At least not noticeable to me. The wrist bone looks the same for now. It's just the one that conenct it to the thumb that sticks out a lot 

[Cubanborn87 42]

1 hour ago, anxietyprince said:

& when I stretch my toes / fingers I see ligaments popping not bone (might be diff for you) try pushing on it and see if it’s squishy (sounds stupid) but ligaments runs across the top of your feet and hands especially when you stretch so you’d see those before bone 

That's a good point. Not sure if those are the ligaments or bones then. I was assuming they were bones but not sure now.

[anxietyprince 4]

If you can press your finger on them and wiggle it around while stretching then those are your ligaments. If it moves at all it’s not bone

[Cubanborn87 42]

You are right, what I am describing are the ligaments.

[anxietyprince 4]

Glad I could help - what I describe is when flexing my fingers and toes straight out it goes down the right side of my left wrist going into my thumb & above my big toe mainly. I think this is what your talking about - mine stick out and are visible to me. Try looking in a mirror - it’s even harder to notice it - maybe why your doctor didn’t think anything of it - he probably sees thousands of hands and feet lol

[anxietyprince 4]

Mainly just know this because I used to play catcher in college/whole life so I’ve had many thumb/wrist injuries previously 

[Worriedfornothing 8]

For simplicity, the first symptom of ALS is pretty much always clinical weakness which is more like paralysis of a muscle group that was being served by the now dead nerve. All else comes secondary to this in the disease process. The only real “early” symptom for our purposes here is clinical weakness. If you do not have clinical weakness then you do not have ALS. I am guilty of looking for atrophy and all that other nonsense but just remind yourself that if you can do normal stuff then you don’t have ALS. If an entire group of muscles is not paralyzed on your body then you do not have ALS.Atrophy also takes a much longer time than people think. Think more months to years for atrophy and by then the disease would have moved on to multiple other muscle symptoms. Atrophy before noticeable weakness is a medical impossibility.

I have also read that perceived dents and and thinner areas are actually just areas of lower body fat and higher muscle mass. My right hand is significantly thinner than my left and it is 10kgs of grip strength stronger. Iyou are worried about the possibility of thumb atrophy, and can still turn a key to drive to work then it is most definitely imagination and not atrophy. Actions like turning a key, screwing on a bottle cap, and buttoning activate all of the thenar muscles.

An EMG is the golden ticket also. Clean EMG means absolutely no ALS. If they test even remotely near the area of concern then the EMG would notice a problem (there is never a problem in our situations). It would also theoretically notice a problem before the person themselves would notice a problem. 

You couldn’t be more alright given what I’ve read about your case. You just need to treat the anxiety and everything will be okay someday soon.

[DoxieMoxie 316]

3 hours ago, Cubanborn87 said:

Thank You, the test went fine. I passed the EMG which I was glad I did. The issue is I am noticing early signs of atrophy on my left foot , leg and hand and maybe the tongue.

That has me really freaked out , I have a follow up in 6 weeks. But I don't like what I am seeing so far. SMH.

My left hand is starting to look wrinkly and my left foot is skinnier. I can feel my shoe really lose on that foot no matter which shoe I wear. My calf is also smaller in my left leg and it seems like you behave lost some muscle mass on my left hand also. On my palm right under my pinky. 

My dear, you need some very tough love.  You have had a clean EMG.  You do not have ALS.  Why are you still here?

You do not have atrophy.  How do I know this? First, you don't know what to look for, and are judging every little dent and asymmetrical occurrence (which is totally normal and occurs in everyone) as atrophy.  Second, you're not telling us that you are unable to do something (have true clinical weakness).  Without that, you cannot have atrophy, which results from disuse.

You need to MOVE ON NOW and start living your life.

[Cubanborn87 42]

1 hour ago, anxietyprince said:

Glad I could help - what I describe is when flexing my fingers and toes straight out it goes down the right side of my left wrist going into my thumb & above my big toe mainly. I think this is what your talking about - mine stick out and are visible to me. Try looking in a mirror - it’s even harder to notice it - maybe why your doctor didn’t think anything of it - he probably sees thousands of hands and feet lol

Yeah that is it, that's great. That's a tough position to play. 

[Cubanborn87 42]

1 hour ago, Worriedfornothing said:

For simplicity, the first symptom of ALS is pretty much always clinical weakness which is more like paralysis of a muscle group that was being served by the now dead nerve. All else comes secondary to this in the disease process. The only real “early” symptom for our purposes here is clinical weakness. If you do not have clinical weakness then you do not have ALS. I am guilty of looking for atrophy and all that other nonsense but just remind yourself that if you can do normal stuff then you don’t have ALS. If an entire group of muscles is not paralyzed on your body then you do not have ALS.Atrophy also takes a much longer time than people think. Think more months to years for atrophy and by then the disease would have moved on to multiple other muscle symptoms. Atrophy before noticeable weakness is a medical impossibility.

I have also read that perceived dents and and thinner areas are actually just areas of lower body fat and higher muscle mass. My right hand is significantly thinner than my left and it is 10kgs of grip strength stronger. Iyou are worried about the possibility of thumb atrophy, and can still turn a key to drive to work then it is most definitely imagination and not atrophy. Actions like turning a key, screwing on a bottle cap, and buttoning activate all of the thenar muscles.

An EMG is the golden ticket also. Clean EMG means absolutely no ALS. If they test even remotely near the area of concern then the EMG would notice a problem (there is never a problem in our situations). It would also theoretically notice a problem before the person themselves would notice a problem. 

You couldn’t be more alright given what I’ve read about your case. You just need to treat the anxiety and everything will be okay someday soon.

Thank You , that was very insightful. I am definitely not failing, I can still do a out everything with that thumb. The only thing that I noticed is when I type with both thumbs on my phone . The left one which is a little slower than my right one, is not as fluid. 

They did test a bunch of muscle groups and they did test exactly where all my problem areas are, so that gives me a little bit of a relief. They actually pinched me exactly by that thumb , which is an area that I have been looking at for a while now.  They also tested where my skinny foot is and my leg. Which is exactly what has made me so confused lately. They have obviously tested all these areas, and this would have been 2 years after my symtoms started. So you would have thought that if something was wrong it would show up on the test. 

I am trying to convince myself to just trust the EMG, but unfortunately until I see my doctor in 6 weeks I don't think I'll be completely at ease.

[morgans 15]

Seriosuly -- clean EMG = NO ALS. The end. 

Move on from this fear before it consumes you. I wasted more than a year of my life worrying about ALS. 

Please let this go. You have done your due diligence and had the appropriate tests, and seen the right doctors. 

Seek treatment for anxiety,. 

[clearhead 129]

2 hours ago, morgans said:

Seriosuly -- clean EMG = NO ALS. The end. 

Move on from this fear before it consumes you. I wasted more than a year of my life worrying about ALS. 

Please let this go. You have done your due diligence and had the appropriate tests, and seen the right doctors. 

Seek treatment for anxiety,. 

He won’t let it go. He knows how the disease progresses, yet chooses to believe the contrary. The EMG done for the symptoms he was presenting was way overboard. The only reason it was done was for his own peace of mind.

Cuban,

I’m sorry to see that your mind is still playing games. Please focus on the fix.